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Message Archive: Messages 1301 - 1350


1350. Circus rhinos, 26 May, 2006 - Hello cicusfans in the USA, at this moment I am preparing an article about rhinos on the circus. Has there ever been a rhino on USA circuses or even performing in the ring? Thank you for an answer, John de Vries - Netherlands editor 'Circusmagazine De Piste'. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 27 May, 2006 - Yes, there have been several. Start with the Togni animal on RBBB recently. Then check for the animals with Dan Rice, John O'Brien, the Great London [shown in a lithograph] and perhaps others. Check David Carlyon's biography of Dan Rice and also Richard J. Reynolds III's article about circus rhinos in "Bandwagon" several decades ago. It can be found in the article index on this website. It provides a basic summary. Subsequent articles provide additional information. Fred Dahlinger

    Reply: 27 May, 2006 - I worked in 1976 with Roman Schmitt in Mexico City. He had a young white rhino. I’m pretty sure he also played Shrine dates in Texas and probably with other shows in the states. Ron Perry

    Reply: 30 May, 2006 - I saw Roman Schmitt's rhino on the Castle show in Indianapolis, IN sometime in the mid-70s. At the time it was about three foot at the shoulder, still a young animal. It would be lead to the ring with a young female Asian elephant - as opposed to Tongi's rhino who came to the ring in a large cage wagon. I believe Roman's rhino was a female black rhino and eventually went to the Columbus, OH zoo.
          For more research: On a recent blog I heard about a rhino Rex Williams trained but don't know if or where it appeared. The Ringling show purchase a young white rhino who may have appeared sometime in the 80s for a short time. He injured his trainer, Mickey Bohannen, and the rhino was sent to another facility. Jim Alexander

    Reply: 30 May, 2006 - In 1960 n the Cristiani Bros. Circus the late Tony Diano had some of his menagerie with the show including a Rhino. The animal was very gently, you could reach thru the bars and pet him or give him a treat. I say him, because as now think of it I don't know whether it was a male or female. The keeper would at times open the back door and go inside with it. Robert Mitchell, RLMENTERTAIN@webtv.net

    Reply: 31 May, 2006 - Carson & Barnes Circus carried a Rhino in their menagerie as well. I don’t know if they still have it or not. I don’t know the species or the male/female status either. Perhaps someone else has better info. Bob Cline

    Reply: 31 May, 2006 - I don't know if it's the same Rhino Bob is talking about,but George Hubler and I stopped by Diano's place in the Summer of '54, and Smokey Jones was there, and he said Tony wanted him to train the Rhino & a Hippo to work together. Bill Strong

    Reply: 10 June, 2006 - I worked with Rex Williams during the summer of 1975. He had a Rhino that I think was named THOR. Late that summer a friend of his stopped by who worked for one of the trade papers. I think it was Varity but I could be wrong. Rex was wanting to sell or trade Thor and ask his friend to take a photo. They said to show how tame I should sit on Thor. Then ask if I could do a head stand on Thor. I did and they got their picture. If you track down that photo I would love a copy. Thanks steveallen60@msn.com

    Reply: 28 June, 2006 - In July of 1898, Detroit, Michigan was treated to a performance of Wormwood's Monkey Theatre and Trained Animal Exhibition under the big top. It was not a large show, but they took out a half page advertisement in the Detroit newspaper. One of the illustrations in the ad was that of Princess Agwan the only trained baby rhinoceros. John Polacsek

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1349. Tiny Kline photographs needed, 25 May, 2006 - >I am publishing Tiny Kline's memoir in late 2006 or early 2007 with the University of Illinois Press. I am seeking any photographs of Tiny Kline. Please contact me at jmdavis1@mail.utexas.edu if you have or know of any photos of Tiny. Thanks, Janet M. Davis Associate Professor of American Studies and History, The University of Texas at Austin. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1348. Active circuses, 25 May, 2006 - I have been a circus fan for years. Do you know how many active circuses there are to date? Is there a list of which ones are active and their routes? I would like to see one other than Ringling. In my life time I have seen Carson Barnes, Polack, Vargas, and others I don’t know the names of. Thank you, Ed Minas. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 26 May, 2006 - If you want to see a circus, you will need to know in advance when they will be in your area. About the only reliable way to see confirm a show is coming would be to subscribe to the "Circus Report," 6290 Harrison Drive, Suite 16, Las Vegas Nevada 89120-4041. (702) 798-6181. In the route section for July 2005 they listed 3 Ringling units, Circus Chimera, Cole Bros., Carson & Barnes, Kelly-Miller and Universoul. John Polacsek

    Reply: 26 May, 2006 - A good start in your quest would be to obtain a copy of the current March-April 2006 issue of the society's journal "Bandwagon." Check the website for how to acquire back copies, or, better yet, join the CHS. The issue contains Fred D. Pfening, Jr.'s excellent survey of 2005 circus activity. These surveys have been published annually for a number of years and serve as a reference for current circuses. There is nothing to equal them published anywhere else. There are other publications, like "Circus Report," that can also be accessed for contemporary circus information. Fred Dahlinger

    Reply: 01 June, 2006 - Another publication you could subscribe to is Backyard, published by Jim Olson, 3040 170th Street, Lansing, IL 60438. This twice monthly contains routes for a number of circuses and also some carnivals. John Goodall

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1347. Circuses, Carnivals 1960s, 24 May, 2006 - I am doing some research on carnivals and circus acts in the mid 1960s. I am trying to find out how rides were set up and taken down at that time. Just some gerneral information, how many people it took and this sort of thing. Even some common problems. the ferris wheel, octopus etc. How long did it take for a small town carnival to set up and take down etc. If there is anyone that could help me I would appreciate any help you could give me. Thanks, Ron M Westerhousin, 1010hap@newnorth.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 31 July, 2006 - During that time period, although many rides were trailer-mounted (meaning attached to a trailer and on wheels, making set-up much quicker), many others were still "ground-mounted." I am not an authority on carnivals but was with one off and on for several years.
          One fact you may find interesting. Carneys consider the ground-mounted ferris wheel to be the most dangerous ride on the Midway. I saw one where one side sunk into mud and was at a precarious angle with riders still aboard. Another ride that was dangerous if it wasn't maintained properly, was the Zipper. I witnessed a Zipper car fall from the top of the ride. Probably some 35 to 50 feet in the air. Fortunately that car was empty.
          I travelled with a small show in the Midwest in the 60s and 70s. Usually a carnival could set up in less than a day, depending on how many rides, concessions there were. Of course how many of the rides were ground-mounted had to be taken into account for this time frame since ground mounted rides had to be put together, literally, from the ground up.
          Adding a little more to what I said before. It took less time to tear down a show, of course. Usually the minute the show closed on the last night, teardown would begin. That was a good time for young men from the town to get jobs helping with it. Usually only the carnies would do the set-up because of the liability involved with the rides, but anyone could help with the teardown.
          Concessions were often made of just 2x4s and canvas. After the stock was removed, it usually took no time at all to tear down a concession. They are called "joints" because they were constructed using 2x4s and door hinges. All you had to do was connect the proper hinges on 2-2x4s and slip in a large nail. They were quick and inexpensive. The same couldn't be said for the canvas, which was usually ordered from a specialty company. It was important to build a joint in a standard size to get ready-made canvas covers, otherwise the cost could go out of sight.
          Troubles could come with a show set up on a concrete or asphalt lot, especially in the Midwest. I once operated a fishbowl joint sitting on a lot somewhere in Oklahoma. It was fortunate I had everything battened down with bungee cords, because a huge dust devil blew through and moved the 14'x14' joint some 3 feet but the bungee-corded stock and display risers held fast.
          In the late 60s Lightning Artist joints were popular, if you had talent. I operated one where I did profiles of people, usually in 3 to 5 minutes (hence the designation, "Lightning"). The advantage to that joint was tearing down consisted of packing away my chalk and folding my easel. The disadvantage was being out in the sun on a hot day, or trying to escape rain.
          All of this is bringing back memories of the old Central States shows that operated in Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas for more that 30 years, by the Moser family which included Malcolm, Georgie and Scobie, and I believe at least one more sibling whose name I don't have. In the Spring each year, Central States worked with many civic organizations in these a number of towns, where they would set up the show and provide the ride help and the stock for the joints, which were operated by the townspeople (such as Kiwanis, Boy or Girl Scouts, Jaycees, and many churches). The Mosers were well-respected in that part of the country for their honesty and reliability. Britt, Marie (TEM), MBritt@express-scripts.com

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1346. Britain's Mammoth Circus set, 24 May, 2006 - Does anyone have any information regarding Britain's Mammoth Circus set, which consists of several metal figurines? Any information at all would be greatly appreciated! Thank You. Dieter von Zeller, Burlington, Massachusetts, USA, email address: mostlygsd@comcast.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 09 July, 2006 - By coincidence I am trying to find the same information concerning Britains (famous as makers of soldier figures) Mammoth Circus items. I have two boxed sets, the largest contains clowns, horses, ring master, tigers, elephants, and a large ring. I don't have access to the sets at this moment but will provide more complete and accurate information later. Each set comes in a large orange box with the figures individually attached by string. I collect old toy trains which include some circus train sets (particularly American Flyer) and these figures make a nice accessory for the circus train motif. Paul Wassermann

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1345. Duttons Circus, 24 May, 2006 - I noticed on Sturtevants list of Circuses this was listed: 1931 Duttons Circus (Nellie Jordan Dutton Pr) (BB May 2 1931). I would like to know more about this circus. Might this Nellie Jordan Dutton be the daughter of Lewis and Maimie Jordan of the Flying Jordans aerial act? Thank you, Janette L. Jones, jljones@molalla.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 05 March, 2007 - I am researching the Flying Jordans. I found a pictures of Josephine Jordan (Nellie's younger sister) in my grandmother's cedar chest. They are all from 1924, and personalized to my gr grandparents. I believe that you are right about her being Lewis(Louis) Jordan's daughter. I found a census that lists Lewis, Mayme(different spellings), Nellie and Josephine. They traveled all over. I have found records that list Nellie and Josephine as both acrobats and actresses in the theatre and circus. I found a record of Nellie being married to a man named Burenstein or something. Will look it up. It listed Nellie and her husband (not the one you said), Josephine and their mother on the census. Have found very little info on the web, but if you Google "The Flying Jordans" you can find a little bit. Nellie and Josephine were also known as "The Jordan Girls", but can't find any info on that either. Would be glad to share info. Ann Laferriere, al7759@tampabay.rr.com

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1344. Theresa Hoyland, 24 May, 2006 - I am researching the history of my great-grandmother who I am told was a bare-back rider in a circus. Her name was Theresa Hoyland born in Brussels in 1849 & came to England in 1870. I am trying to find if there is an archive of circus performers and wondered if you could help. I would be most gratefull for any information you could give me. Kind regards, Eileen Wright. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 05 July, 2006 - You could try the archives in the following link http://users.nwon.com/pauline/Travellers.html where British showman, circus performers etc in the 19th century have been painstakenly shifted from the public registry files. At a glance, I haven't found any Theresa Hoyland. But as she was Belgian, isn't it possible that her name was Hooyland? Natasha Gerson

    Reply: 20 Apr 2008 - Not sure if there is any relation, but my great, great grandfather was a vaudville performer named Harry Hoyland. We are trying to find his story as well. Scott Acomba, Victoria

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1343. Carnivals, 22 May, 2006 - I am trying to find information on how carnivals were set up and torn down in the mid 1960s. Thanks, Ron. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 01 June, 2006 - Try the following web site. carnivalwarehouse.com. JIM ELLIOTT

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1342. Dick Clemens, 22 May, 2006 - Can anyone out in cyberland come up with any Dick Clemens material? I was a long time friend but know almost nothing about his circus career. White Tops 1979 vol. 52 #6 would be a nice start. Copys or scans would be fine. I'm sad to report his widow Mary passed away recently in his home town of Grand Meadow Minn. Thanks, Terry Lewis, Tucson, AZ, terrylewis613@hotmail.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 14 May 2007 - What a coincidence! My mother worked as Dick's assistant for the lion act from 1948-1952. I am currently writing a biography called, Passing Through the Lion's Cage, which goes into detail about their four years together. My email is godoys@intelnet.net.gt or carolinekellems@yahoo.com. Caroline Kellems-Godoy, Guatemala City

    Reply: 24 May 2007 - Hi, My wife Nancy and I are former circus performers and owned Delano Society Circus in California from 1962-68. Back in 1958 (we then had two small sons) we found ourselves in Kingfisher, Oklahoma. Dick Clemons produced a "free" circus for the fair there. I believe at that time he owned a meat packing house or cold storage in the area. In any case, Nancy and I performed as "The Embers" fire act with his show. Dick had a pretty strong show for the fair. Acts included "Los Platos" high act (Sven and Lilli Kristensen); The Kristensen bareback riding act; "Tito" Flint as clown. Joe Frisco and his slack wire and comedy car, Terrell (and his first wife) Juanita (Ward) Jacobs presenting their dog act and Dolly Jacobs with her three elephants, Dumbo, Modoc and Judy. Mary Clemons held her pet bobcat as she sang "God Bress Amelica" in her charming Japanese accent. She was a grand lady and we corrosponded with her until her death. We have several 8 X 10 photos of Dick and his cat act. When I have the time I would be happy to scan and e-mail you some photos of Dick. Currently I am deep in a project but will see what I can do if you are interested. Please use my personal e-mail address for coresponding, djmoyer55@telisphere.com, Donn and Nancy Moyer.

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1341. Memories Of Big Bertha, 22 May, 2006 - Hello All: When someone mentions the word circus my mind shouts Ringling Bros. & Barnum and Bailey Combined Shows. I grew up in Erie, Pa. where for 18 different seasons "The Big One" gave us 'The Greatest Show on Earth.' I was fortunate to see the four trains arrive...I saw them unload and head to the show grounds on Cherry St. and erect the biggest of all the big tops. I sat on an Arthur Concello seat wagon. I saw and heard Maestro Merle Evans and his mighty circus band. My mother and I sat enthralled for nearly three hours to the greatest acts in the world. I witnessed the long mount of 40 elephants. I was introduced to the ringmaster Count Nicholas not sure of his spelling. Through my late Dad being with Sealtest Milk I had a glass under the cook tent. 1951 was a very special summer as I saw the same show that was captured on film called simply "The Greatest Show On Earth" so every time I watch the VHS version I am watching my youth.
      In 1999 I took my wife and granddaughter to State College to see the indoor version now in the Feld organization and after the performance one of the clowns asked my then 7 year old granddaughter how she liked the show and her answer was it just wasn't the same as the TV movie my grampa likes to watch. The clown's mouth dropped and he said I am not sure what movie that is. I said it was the finest movie about RBB&B ever filmed. I later received an email from him and he said WOW I had no idea what used to be.
      To a 7 year old boy feeling a hot summer's day heat and smelling the scent of freshly cut grass and then seeing the five main pole big top and hearing the sounds of the diesel powered generators and sipping lemonade and hearing step this way to the big show ... there's only one Ringling Bros. & Barnum and Bailey Circus I knew I was in an environment that was truly special. I could go on and on about this most special of times in my life. I feel so fortunate to have been born at a time in our country's history when it was safe to walk to downtown Erie and feel safe. A time when live entertainment was fresh and gay and hot and safe for everyone and you saw it in a 10,000 seat tented arena.
      Thank You John and Henry Ringling North, Arthur Concello, Merle Evans and many others. I will never forget seeing Big Bertha in person under the big top where it belongs. Best, Craig Johnson, Lock Haven, Pa. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 24 May, 2006 - Hi Craig, I enjoyed your recollections of seeing RBB&B during its heyday under canvas. I share some of those memories with you, having grown up in Plainville, CT, where Big Bertha set up in central Connecticut during the 1950s after the Hartford circus fire made them unwelcome guests in the Insurance Capital. What's on Cherry Street now where the show used to set up in Erie? In Plainville there's a great big mall on the old circus grounds - a place that used to be known as Joe Tinty's Plainville Stadium. I took my grandson to a movie there not long ago and as we walked the length of the parking lot into the movie theatre, I could see the ghosts of Emmett Kelly, Merle Evans, Harold Alzana, Art and Antoinette Concello, Felix Adler, Lou Jacobs and Ruth the elephant. Thanks for bringing back some wonderful memories. Rick Whelan, rickwhelan@sympatico.ca

    Reply: 26 May, 2006 - Rick: The old circus grounds in Erie on Cherry St. should have been set aside and dedicated for fairs, carnivals and namely called reserved for "The Circus" as this location was in a central location. If it had to be converted which it was, higher education in my opinion should be the only buildings to be built. Erie did so and a middle school and high school are sitting on the site where once the biggest of the big tops brought so much laughter and excitement to the folks of Erie, Pa. To me, the show grounds on Cherry St. will always be where 'Big Bertha' visited Erie for a total of 18 times from 1919-1956. In fact, 'Big Bertha' last visited the show grounds 50 years ago this July 10th. Just 6 days before she took her last gasp of air and sadly passed on in Pittsburgh, Pa. on the 16th. The last time I saw her was on a hot July 19, 1952 afternoon set up in all her glory at the Cherry St. show grounds. To those of us who remember 'Big Bertha' under canvas very few earthly events in 2006 come close to what we all enjoyed in "our" youth! Nearly 50 years has passed since her passing...to me it was like yesterday and I miss her greatly. Guess you can call it a part of my youth stolen away into my memory system. Best, Craig, Lock Haven

    Reply: 02 June, 2006 - Thank you, Craig, for sharing such rich and heart-stirring memories of a remarkable era in the American circus. How I envy you for all the shows you saw under the "Big Bertha" of big tops! I saw only one, the epic 1955 edition when it played Pt. Richmond, California. And my memories of that most magical of days never die. How lucky we are to have the movie. I watch it often still. Enjoy your lucky recollections! David Lewis Hammarstrom

    Reply: 04 June, 2006 - David: I may have mislead you in my wonderful memories of Big Bertha. I was born in 1943. My references to her showing 18 different years was to establish just how important Erie was to the coffers of R B & B and B Combined Shows. I saw her in 1948-1951 and 1952. My interests are the circus...railroading and the mighty Wurlitzer theatre pipe organ. Of the three Big Bertha takes center stage. David, I have your book on Johnny North and it is excellent. You knew these great showmen and I salute YOU for your monumental work which I reread often. THANK YOU! I only wish I had known Art Concello and JRN and HRN in the early 1950s and would have had the cash to have kept her well managed and in line with the various unions and in reality a smaller show. Seeing the show in 1951 and then seeing the movie at the Warner Theatre in Erie in 1952 I was there in person so to speak seeing and hearing the same music...acts and all. No other means can transport me back to my youth like the movie can. Having been a broadcast journalist in the Navy with both the Navy Times and Armed Forces Radio and then with Knight Radio we have a lot in common. If only there had been a Ringling or a North to come forward and lead her. I have spoken with many former persons that were involved with her and most said Farewell Years could have been had and during that time, she could have shed some of her bulk and still have held that famous title: THE GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH! It really hurts to see what she has become and I realize the following is looking through rose colored glasses. However, if I won the big lottery I would bring together the best in the business and see IF she could return to canvas. Our country needs what we took for granted in the 1950s. Regards, Craig Johnson, Lock Haven, Pa. With that in mind, Big Bertha might still be here under canvas.

    Reply: 07 June, 2006 - Craig: Thanks much for your generous comments about my book on JRN. Much appreciated. I am glad and proud that I was able to write it and get it published. And I congratulate you for your work in the Navy and with the Armed Forces Radio. As for Big Bertha, well, you still you saw more under-canvas performances than I did, so consider yourself historically privileged! Big top regards, David.

    Reply: 13 June, 2006 - David: You are most welcome. Of all the books about The Ringlings and their "Greatest Show On Earth" none can compare to your one on one of the man who owned "Big Bertha" under canvas and then took her into indoor arenas. In this the 50th anniversary year of when her tents fell for the last time I am so grateful I had the opportunity of living in the twilight of the greatest generation to love the finest of circuses Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Combined Shows, Inc. Best, Craig

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1340. Walton & Barlow, 21 May, 2006 - Looking for any descendents of the Walton & Barlow circus, which toured the midwest in the early 1900s. The partners were Edwin Walton and Jack Barlow (the latter was from Chicago). Edwin Walton, who was from Traer, Kansas, was a slack rope walker. His sister, Pearl was a horse bareback rider. In circa 1914, Edwin's 3-year-old daughter, Vivian used to stand on a wooden plank stage and sing "Home Sweet Home" and specators would throw coins for her. I have no documentation or pictures, only the stories handed down from generation to generation. Would be interested in finding anything such as posters or flyers or photos of the circus and performers. Britt, Marie, MBritt@express-scripts.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 June, 2006 - I believe that there may be a panorama view of this circus filed in the Circus World Museum library. It was taken by the same photographer, Joseph Young [Oberlin, KS?], who made the famous panorama view of the entire Campbell Bros. Circus of circa 1908. I recall it as a modest overland show. George Chindahl, whose collection is also housed there, didn't include the title within his listing; however, he had a special interest in such troupes and his files and note cards may have some information. Many small, Midwestern outfits existed and unless they forwarded coverage to a trade journal their existence is largely unrecorded today. Orin King chronicled several such circuses in his Kansas circus history work. His raw notes are also at the same facility. The Barlow name is a known one in outdoor show annals [i. e., Barlow's Big City Shows], but whether a member of that same family was part of the "Walton &" operation remains to be determined. Fred Dahlinger

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1339. Al Stencell, 19 May, 2006 - Hey Al, Just a note to say hi and to find out when your new book was comming out. You can reach me at jbean@valdostatourism.com. Joe Schmitt. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 14 June, 2006 - Hi Joe, Thanks for your interest in the new book. It's coming along. It should be ready soon and out next spring. My own tardyness missed the fall publishing deadline. Hope you are well. Best, Al

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1338. Goodings Million Dollar Midways, 19 May, 2006 - Im looking for any pictures of Goodings Million Dollar Midways. Please let me know if you have any. Thanks, Jim, jjswain2005@yahoo.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 01 June, 2006 - Try the following web site, carnivalwarehouse.com. JIM ELLIOTT

    Reply: 29 Nov 2007 - Contact Wayne Berra, who was the tecnical director on the show. He has pictures of the show. [Contact Billy for Berra's phone number.] Billy Johnson, emptysaddles@verizon.net.

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1337. New Great Syndicate Shows, 19 May, 2006 - I am looking for any information about "The New Great Syndicate Shows Paris Hippodrome." I have some original posters from the Ashland Oregon area for July 18, 1887. Thanks for any information. Rich Oliver, Las Vegas NV, rrichlizrich@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 22 May, 2006 - I have a question regarding your dating of the posters for this show. The Great Syndicate Shows and Paris Hippodrome title was used in 1895. According to the New York Clipper the show was to have been in Canada on that date, but played Oregon and Washington instead. July 14 was a Sunday, 15 Oregon City, Ore. then 16 Salem, Ore. then 17 at Eugene, Ore., the 18 was Ashland, Ore. confirmed by a newspaper advertisement. I will need to check the lot contracts for the show as I have most of 1893, 94 and 95. I have also been doing a history of the show through research in the New York Clipper and the original lot contracts. The show opened in Denver. Colorado May 2 then played Utah, South Dakota, Wyoming, Idaho, Oregon, Washington, California, Texas, and Kansas. John Polacsek, artistofdetroit@aol.com

    Reply: 23 March, 2007 - Hi, Rich, I'm responding to your May, 2006 posting on circushistory.org, in which you said you have some July 1887 circus posters from Ashland, Oregon. We are working to build an Ashland Railroad Museum, and seeking information about the circus here from the late 1800s, as the railroad was affiliated with it at the time. Any information you could share would be appreciated. We might also be interested in purchasing posters for the museum should you be interested. I've copied this to your other email address, should this one be outdated. I've also copied it to Victoria Walker, director of the new museum. You may respond directly to her if you wish. Thank you, Jeannie Chapman, Ashland, Oregon

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1336. Ralph Holland, Slide of Death, 18 May, 2006 - Ralph Holland aka The Slide of Death - Does anyone know of this person who died in either 1909 or 1910 while performing? Thank you for any help. Pat Smith, Pmooneysmith@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1335. Family, Fantasy Island, 18 May, 2006 - Hello everyone! I don't know who can help me, but in the mid to late 1970's I met a family that worked in the circus at Fantasy Island amusement park Grand Island, New York (near Buffalo). The father was named Tarzan and he trained the lions, Jackie was the mom who was a trapeze artist and they had two daughters. One daughter rode horses and the other did tricks on the "rope". The girls would most likely be around 40 years of age now. Our family was friends with Jewel Lesniak which was a friend of theirs. I just always wanted to know whatever happened to that family and if they still perform seperately or together. I will always remember the fun we had when we would visit them every summer and I was always "awe struck" with the exciting life they led. Anyone know where they are? I am now 35 and to this day I always think of them and how much they impacted my life. Bridget, bgilewski@yahoo.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 19 May, 2006 - You are referring to the Tarzan Zerbini family. Tarzan is a large scale Circus Producer now a days. His Lion act days are over but always well remembered. His wife Jacqueline was the Goddess of the air at the time you knew them. They are no longer together. She has continued to perform and even worked a tiger act for John Cuneo for a few years. I can’t tell you exactly what she is doing today. One of their daughters is Sylvia Zerbini. She is the star of the Ringling Hometown Edition or Gold Unit. Her combination aerial lyre and horse act is astounding. Their other daughter is Patricia Zerbini. She has been around elephants most of her life and owns a huge male Asian named Luke that she performs. She was associated with the Ringling Breeding program for years. Bob Cline

    Reply: 27 May, 2006 - Thank you Bob for all that information. Amazing I wondered for so long and now I can look up where they will be and maybe see them perform again. Much appreciated, Bridget

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1334. Flying DaComas, 18 May, 2006 - Does anyone remember the Flying DaComa's in England around the early 1800's? howard frisbie, howielou@comcast.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 June, 2006 - A DaComa trapeze troupe was with Ringling in 1897 and perhaps other years. There's slight mention of them in Steve Gossard's book on the trapeze. He also reproduced a poster of them (page 132) and another poster solely illustrating them also exists. Further information could be found in 1897 newspapers, 1897 Ringling route book and advertising, the New York Clipper and so on. Fred Dahlinger

    Reply: 18 September, 2006 - My husband's great grand uncle was one of the Flying Da Comas (Arthur, wife, Rose). Mention is made of them in a 1910 program of the Norris & Rowe circus. A copy of the program: www.circushistory.org/bandwagon/bw-1959Nov.htm. Also listed in Olympians of the Sawdust www.circushistory.org/Olympians/OlympiansD1.htm. It says: "Orrin Bros., Mexico, April 1893; Edward Shipp's Winter Circus, Petersburg, IL 1893-94; Ringling Bros.", 1896." Reference The Fying Da Comas: www.circushistory.org/History/List1910.htm. Good Luck. Joann Nelander

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1333. Thor Curran, 18 May, 2006 - I'm trying to find Thor Curran. He worked with Hugo Zacchini for years in the 1980's and possibly the early 90's. I believe he could've worked Hugo's cannon towards the end of his tenure. The last I heard was he had bought an aerial rigging from the Albani's (motorcycle, round track/single trap at other end). Any information would be so helpful. Thank you! Brenda Wood, Portland, OR. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 June, 2006 - Try contacting Hugo Zacchini in Tampa, FL. Fred Dahlinger

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1332. Princess Dixie King, 18 May, 2006 - I am trying to obtain any information on a lion tamer by the name of Princess Dixie King. She was with the Johnny J. Jones Exposition and possibly the Patterson's Animal Show, and the Hagen & Wallace Show. She performed from the 1920's to the late 1930's. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thanking you, Richard Bennett - rebennettreb@yahoo.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 27 May, 2006 - Hello - My grandfather owned the Great Patterson Shows and my father was a press agent for Hagenbeck-Wallace. I have three photographs of an unidentified woman with a tiger. Do you suppose there's a chance they might be photographs of Princess Dixie King? I can e-mail the images, if you'd like. Claire Andersen claireandersen@gmail.com

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1331. Hootnanny, 18 May, 2006 - My sister is searching for information on a Hootnanny. My father traveled with a carnival/circus in the 1930's and she has a picture of a Hootnanny. (Dad has been gone 17 years) I don't know if you would have any information or could direct me to were we could get information. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you. Wanda Van Dee, Marion, IA. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1330. Abe Korkey Goldstein, 17 May, 2006 - I'm doing research on the life and career of Abe "Korkey" Goldstein. Abe was best known as "Korkey the Comic Cop". I have heard that Abe was at one time with Ringling Brothers B & B. Can anyone tell me the year/ years that he was on tour with them? I have been trying to piece together his circus career, which spanned more than 60 years! Any information would be of great help. Many thanks! Michael Campino, Daly City, California, gogogazelle@earthlink.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - Goldstein also did work at Savin Rock, the amusement zone near New Haven, CT. Check with Harold Hartman at the Savin Rock Museum for details. Fred Dahlinger

    Reply: 19 May, 2006 - Thank you for the tip. I will follow it up! Best wishes, Michael

    Reply: 25 September, 2006 - My name is Jette Goldkette Sørensen. I wonder if your Goldstein is related to Mine Goldstein married to: Hertz Abraham Levi (Called Hartwig Goldkette) born 2 oct 1805 - 2 children: 1. Louis Goldkette b 1834 Berlin, Germany and 2. Jeanette Goldkette b 1837. If you have any informations about the family Goldstein please contact me jetgold@webspeed.dk, and good luck with Abe

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1329. Elephant Babe, 17 May, 2006 - I am looking for information regarding an elephant named "Babe" who may have been part of the Harrington's Nickle Plate Circus(1932-1934) or Harrington's Nickle Plate Circus and Pawnee Bill's Act. According to Joseph Bradbury's article in BANDWAGON, Harrington leased an elephant named Daisy (from Christy) and had another elephant named Fredia. But I think there may have also been an elephant in Harrington's act named Babe. Does anyone have any information? Many thanks, and thanks for your informative website. Laurie, champion@mail.sdsu.edu. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 July 2007 - My mother worked an elephant that my father always referred to as "the famous run away Babe". This was in the 40's. Could this be the one you're looking for? Fred Bergen East Palatka, FL

    Reply: 27 Nov 2007 - In 1947 I worked Babe on the Sparks Circus that was owned by Jimmy Edgar who was Domino sugar heir. She was leased from the Ringling Show with four other elephants. At that time she was known as Cross Country Babe. Whitey Haven had the elephants that year. The show didn't last the season and closed in Canada. From there my husband and I went to the Clyde Beatty circus. Babe was supposed to be an outlaw but she worked just great. The five elephants we got had been left in Sarasoa and not taken on the road with the Ringling Show for several years. I have interesting stories about that time, I am 78 years old and this brought back many memories. Dorothy Brown Scroggins

    Reply: 30 Nov 2007 - Hi, In 1949 and 1950 Cole Bros Circus I worked an elephant named Babe that I have never forgotten. She was very well trained and a sweet thing. She was a small elephant. I have a picture if me doing a lift on her trunk. I looked her up in Cole brothers circus elephants, there were several Babes. She died at a very old age. She saved my life once. I never forgot her. Good luck, Betty Paterson Smyth

    Reply: 22 Jun 2008 - Betty, I hope you get this, I am Dolores Mummery's grand-daughter, I almost burst into tears when I saw your reply, I hope you see this, I would love to talk to you. I miss my grandmother so much. And you would know things about her, that I would love to know. My name is Kristina, I am Diane's Daughter. You met my daughter Kristian when you came to my grandmother in Oct 95. Please contact me my email is itsfridaaay@hotmail.com. And for the poster I also have the copy of that photo of Betty on Babe's trunk, I emailed you :) Kristina

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1328. Wylie Franks Troupe, 17 May, 2006 - Does anyone have any knowledge about "The Wylie Franks Troupe" or anyone with the last name of Franks concerning any circus history facts or personal stories? Thanks. pearson5@houston.quik.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1327. Frederick Adkins, elephant trainer, 17 May, 2006 - I am searching for any information of my great uncle Frederick Adkins born 1875 in Norfolk UK, who was an elephant trainer in the late 1890s with Pinders Circus mainly in France. I have a photo of him (aka Curley) with an elephant called "Punch". Any information would be greatly appreciated. There is a possibility that he died in Canada in the 1950s. Thanks, Keith Adkins. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1326. Volaine Troupe, 17 May, 2006 - Was there ever a made for TV movie made of the Volaine Troupe family of high wire artists? If so, do you know what the name of it was. Judy Kilborne, kilborne@adelphia.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 05 March, 2007 - Hello , my name is William Andrus and I am a descendant of John Volaine son of John and Margaret Volaine of the Volaine troupe. I am too searching for the imformation on this family. I would like to share the info I have about the family as well as see yours. Could we please correspond about the Volaines.

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1325. Ringling Bros. Houston, 17 May, 2006 - Does anyone know when Ringling Bros and Barnum & Bailey Circus performed in Houston, Texas during the years 1976 and 1978? Any responses are greatly appreciated. Suzy Ingram - snclri@sbcglobal.net, Longview, Texas. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 24 May, 2006 - According to their program for 1978, the Red Unit with Gunther Gebel Williams played Houston Tuesday July 11 to Sunday July 23rd. Therefore the Red Unit also played Houston in 1976 because they swap routes every two years with the Blue Unit. I don't have a 1976 program so I don't know if the route is even in it. Your best source of information will be to search the Houston area newspapers. You would have a pretty good chance starting in the middle of July area to look for information. Bob Cline

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1324. Farrell Brothers, 17 May, 2006 - I am looking for any photos, programs or videos with the Farrell Brothers high wire act. They performed from 1979 through 1984 mostly in Europe, Asia and Australia. Thanks, Farrell Hettig, fhettig@tampabay.rr.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1323. Seven Astons, 17 May, 2006 - My mom was one of the seven Astons risibly act. Jawow@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1322. Hagenbeck 1905, 17 May, 2006 - Do you have any photos or posters of The Carl Hagenbeck Trained Animal Show - Season 1905? My ancestors, The Aldeans, toured with this show. I have one photo of a gymnast act practicing, but I don't know where or when it was taken. Thanks for any help you can give me. Pattie, pjc3219@cs.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - Hi Pattie, I am also very interested to find any information on the Hagenbeck show of 1905-6. My Grandfather and Great Uncles toured on that show. They were Bare Back Riders. I believe they were " The Eduard Karoly Riding Troupe" They were Hungarians. They also worked at the Hippodrome in New York during that era. I hope that you find some information. Erny Karoly

    Reply: 19 May, 2006 - Foto's from Carl Hagenbeck and posters of Karoly family on circusmuseum.nl/eng. Herman Voogd, hvoogd@teylersmuseum.nl

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1321. Monkey Racetrack or Doc Elec Jones, 17 May, 2006 - I am wondering if anyone has ever heard of the Monkey Racetrack or Doc Elec Jones and wife Bonnie LaTour (Ella Olive Lewis)? They may have been with the Hagenbeck-Wallace (or some combination thereof) Circus. I believe that Mr. Jones also worked for Ringling Bros. and Dotson Bros. sometime around 1940 or so. Also, I was reading the other day about Frank Robbins and his daughter Winona. It said that Winona had eloped with Ray Anders. I thought I had read where she was working for her father at a later date. Does anyone know if she returned to the circus (with or without husband Ray) or anything about Ray Anders? Any information about this interesting bunch will be appreciated. Lynn, McCannPrince@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - Winona Robbins married Ray Anders on or about 9 November 1910. She was 18 years old and he was 5 years older. The marriage lasted hardly a year. Winona apparently was a very bright and ambitious young lady. She stayed with the show until it closed in the early fall of 1915. Not only was she a featured performer, she also was very successful as a press agent. She and her mother Mattie continued to support Frank A Robbins on his many show business adventures until he died in October 1920. Winona worked as a secretary in Jersey City. It was reported in 1926 that Winona was engaged to a non-professional named Cyril M. Wilson of Brooklyn, NY. We have no record that they actually married. Later she married Arthur Willing and lived in Hollywood, Florida. Her mother Mattie lived with them until she died in 1950. I do not know when Winnie died. Perhaps Ward Hall would know. Robert F Sabia

    Reply: 14 June, 2006 - Hi, my second book Seeing Is Believing, ECW Press, Toronto, Ontario has chapter on monkey shows and explains the origins of the monkey speedway and the variations of it. Al Stencell

    Reply: 12 July, 2006 - Thank you so much for the information and your reply. I'm sorry it took a bit to get back here but I had almost fogotten the post. Your time is appreciated. Lynn

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1320. Circus Train Wreck 1892, 17 May, 2006 - In the 1999 children's book "SURVIVAL! Train Wreck, 1892" by Kathleen Duey & Karen A. Bale, the "Hamilton-Shaw Railroad Circus" suffers a train wreck in Kansas that ends in the deaths of several human performers and injuries to many of the circus animals, including elephants and a Bengal tiger. Unfortunately, I can't find any evidence whatsoever that this disaster actually HAPPENED. Does anyone know if this circus train wreck actually occurred, and, if so, where I can research it more fully? If it is a completely fictional event, does anyone know of any comparable (in era/location, severity not necessary) circus train wrecks that are actual historic events (and somewhat easily researchable)? H*, hlerner@knox.edu, Edmond, OK. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - Why not contact the authors, via their publisher, and inquire of them as to the research that they conducted? There were two Ringling railroad mishaps in 1892, one at Concordia, KS on May 17 and another at Centralia, MO on October 18. From the limited content that you abstracted, they may have "merged" the two to create their central "event." Fred Dahlinger

    Reply: 19 May, 2006 - This is H (the original poster of this query): Where can I find more information on the Concordia, KS 1892 Ringling Bros. rail mishap?

    Reply: 21 May, 2006 - There is coverage in the weekly trade serial "New York Clipper" and also in the 1892 Ringling Bros. route book. There may also be coverage in the local newspapers. [check for availability of the magazine and newspaper via interlibrary loan; maybe someone can send an abstract from the route book directly to your posted address?] There are no known photographs of the mishaps. Fred Dahlinger

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1319. Billy D. Wolfe, strongman, 17 May, 2006 - I'm looking for information on a strong man/boxer for Barnum and Bailey by the name Billy D. Wolfe. He may have gone by the name Superman. Thank you. Gretchen Price Palestine Oh. gretch42257@erinet.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1318. David Larible, 17 May, 2006 - What year did David Larible join Ringling? frankiegee1@verizon.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 30 Sep 2007 - I believe that would have been 1992. Sylvia Hernandez DiStasi, The Actors Gymnasium, Noyes Cultural Arts Center, Evanston, IL

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1317. Harry Hart, stiltwalker, 17 May, 2006 - I am trying to find a stiltwalker named Harry Hart or Long Harry. He worked for Ringling Bros about 12 years in the 1920's or 30's. I know he was in avertising after he left the circus any information would be appreciated. Ruth Hart Yates, ery839 @aol. com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1316. Clyde Beatty Circus 1948, 17 May, 2006 - I am looking for a train loading list or vehicle inventory for the 1948 Clyde Beatty Circus. Thank you for your help. Fred Heatley, Laurens, SC, fheatley@backroads.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - The late Jim Caldwell studied the Beatty rail show during the 1940s and 1950s and deduced train loading orders from available photography. His notes are now in the possession of Robert S. MacDougall. His work also covered Sparks wagons that ended up on Beatty and later went to Strates Shows. Fred Dahlinger

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1315. George Patterson, Bouding Patterson, 17 May, 2006 - Any information you can send me on him. I do know he was performing in London, England in July of 1912. He was the first person to do a double saumersault off the trapeze with out a net. thank you. caprariocp@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1314. Circus Huntsville 1976, 17 May, 2006 - When I was a young kid I worked in the circus selling concessions, it was in Huntsville Alabama about 1976. When I was working there was a lion tamer that was attacked and mulled in front of me. What I’ve wanted to know is what his name was and what ever happened to him after that. If anyone has any information I would appreciate the time to let me know. Needless to say I’ve NEVER been to a circus since! J, joeldooris@hotmail.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1313. Van Amburgh's Circus, 17 May, 2006 - My Grandfather, Clarence A. Lawton also known as "Deacon Lawton", in 1887 ran away from home in Ithaca New York and "joined the circus" teaming up with Tony Posetta, an old Italian Clown, in Van Amburgh's Circus and traveled for four years. He has written up some of his experiences about this that I have. He also was an endman with Kenyon-Etz and the Imperial Minstrels. He teamed up with Mountjoy Walker and they toured as light opera comedians with the Kerwin-Wilbur Co. and the La Grau Company. He also worked with circus clowns, Frank "Chick" Torkela, and Abo Feth Saleh from Damascus, Syria. as well as Tony Posetta. In October 1934 the four - Torkla, Posetta, and Saleh and my grandfather - held a reuinion and recorded in the paper that "When we were clowns, we had to work. The four of us were acrobats. We were no mere walk-abouts like the clowns of today." Do you have any information on any of these people or the circus. I see a few references in your online "Bandwagon" publication. regarding the Van Amburgh Circus. Pictures would be wonderful. I will be glad to pay for research and copies as needed for this. I can supply more of Clarences notes as well. Thank you for your kind atttention. Raymon E. Lawton, Fairfield, California, lawray@pvbb.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1312. William Mitchell, 17 May, 2006 - I am looking for information about William Mitchell, who worked with circuses in the 1930s through 1950s. He was a mechanical superintendent and invented a machine for folding circus tents. jean.novotny@arizonarepublic.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1311. Harry M. Darling, trapeze, 30 April, 2006 - Harry M. Darling was a flying trapeze artist around 1880 in Minnesota and Wisconsin. Is there any way of finding information on his performances? Pat Darling, pdarling@bmt.net, Dillon, MT. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1310. Victor McLaglen,circus boxer, strongman, 30 April, 2006 - Would anyone know for which American or Canadian circus he boxed and was a strongman for, around 1909-1914? Reportly,if you could last 3 rounds with him,you would win $25.00. Victor McLaglen went on of course to become a famous actor and won an Academy Award in 1935(The Informer). Rufus Ledbetter, apemonsterman@yahoo.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1309. Circus, Long Island 1967-70, 30 April, 2006 - Looking for the name of the small tented circus with a Western theme that played Westhampton Long Island New York between 1967-1970. Any help would be appreciated. Frank Lynch, Lynchcircus@yahoo.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 17 May, 2006 - More than likely, the show would have been the Royal Ranch Wild West Circus, it was owned by Ozzie Schleentz, he was from New Jersey, and was also a sign painter so the show was painted up real nice. The show started out as a real Gem!, but unfortunetly spiralled downward until it closed in the mid seventies. The last time I saw Ozzie was in the mid eighties, he was a booking agent for the Great American Circus, I believe he died from complications of Diabetes. Bobby Fairchild

    Reply: 17 May, 2006 - That could have been the "Royal Ranch Wild West Circus". It was owned by Ozzie and Lila Schleentz. I was on the show at that time. George Rowe - "Kalamar"

    Reply: 17 May, 2006 - The show you are asking about could have been "Royal Ranch Wild West Circus". I am not sure that the show was out quite as early as '67. The Clyde Beatty-Cole Bros. Circus seemed to have the exclusive on the Long Island dates, but other shows may have played there. Jim Cole

    Reply: 18 May, 2006 - Thanks so much for the info. I remember the show because they offered us teenagers $5 to help them load up the tent. It must have been an old canvas one because it was the heaviest thing I ever lifted. And to think the "Wild West" came out of New Jersey! Thanks as always, Frank Lynch, Shandi Amusements, Orlando

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1308. Rhineharts, bareback act, 29 April, 2006 - I am looking for any information about a bareback act with the Mighty Yankee Robinson Circus, late 1910's into the 1920's. Sarah and Jim Rhinehart. I believe they were sister and brother. I am particularly interested in tracking down a poster from the era that feature the Rhineharts. Thanks, CS Blair, imustbeoff@sbcglobal.net. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1307. Clark's Greater Shows, 29 April, 2006 - Looking for information on Clark's Greater Shows, probably mostly in Illinois. Thanks! Greg Nelson, Keizer, Oregon. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 June, 2006 - Joe McKennon's "Pictorial History of the American Carnival" lists Clark's Greater Shows as operational 1920-1923, 1928, 1940, 1961-1965. It must have been a motorized operation. If you scan weekly issues of Billboard magazine during the years in question you might learn the site of their winter quarters. That would lead to determining the names of the owners and further information opportunities. You might also try checking newspapers at www.newspaperarchive.com. I'll copy some carnival historians on this response and perhaps they can provide some additional insight. Fred Dahlinger

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1306. Pietro, pantomime, 26 April, 2006 - I am looking for a master pantomime named Pietro. Not sure if he was well known or like many performers, just a practitioner of his craft. I Have no last name and not sure if he performed in the circus, legitimate theatre or in the streets. Time frame between 1865 and 1911. Not sure if the location is France, England or Italy. Only information I have is Europe. He was the teacher during the summer months for Egbert Austin Williams, America's most famous black vaudeville artist and instrumental in teacher Bert the techniques evident in his famous poker sketch. I have been searching for a long time, tried almost everything. I hope you have some leads on any bearer of this name. Thank you. Ms. Scottie Davis. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

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1305. Tom-Tom elephant, 26 April, 2006 - I have a circus poster of Yankee Robinson show. It has a photo of an elephant named TOM-TOM. Do you have any information on either one. I know elephant died in 1909. Any info would be greatly appreciated. JGroz933@aol.com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 April, 2006 - Several newspapers reported the following story, dateline Des Moines, Iowa, April 9, 1909. “Tom” an elephant in the winter quarters of the “Yankee Robinson” circus, ran amuck and, seizing his keeper, Charles Bellow, hurled him high into the air and then trampled him to death. The excited beast then ran through the animal park, uprooted small trees, destroyed three circus wagons, and demolished a bridge across a lagoon. Richard Georgian, Florida

    Reply: 30 April, 2006 - I've been standing back thinking someone else would answer this one but here goes. Fred Buchanan acquired Tom Tom (I believe a male) about 1904, possibly from the George Jabour carnival, which Joe McKennon lists as breaking up about that time. Tom Tom was with Buchanan's Yankee Robinson show until he drowned 24 June 1911 at Cumberland, Wisconsin; this date comes from Chindahl. According to Don Marcks his tusks were removed and his body was dumped in the fire pit of a local mill. He is known to have killed handler Charles Barlow in April 1909 before the show had left quarters. The show itself had wintered at Granger, Iowa, but the animals were still being kept at Ingersoll Park in Des Moines. Ree-gards, Ole Whitey

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1304. James & Ulysees Grant DeUnger, 23 April, 2006 - We have very little information to share, but are looking for any clues as to the history surrounding these two men. They are twins, and joined the circus or another travelling show between 1910 and 1920. There is a picture that the family has of them in some type of circus costume. They were born and grew up in Baltimore MD, and James shows up in the Baltimore Census in 1910 as a wagon driver. There is no information found on that census about Grant (as he was commonly known). Both men are listed in draft records for Baltimore, MD in 1917. Grant lists his job as Dairyman and James lists his job as foreman. After that 1917 record, they seem to drop off the face of the earth. James' wife, Pearle shows up in 1920, seemingly abandoned with her son. What shows were travelling threw Baltimore during that time period? I thought of Ringling Bros. and see that Baltimore was on their regular route. Any others? Where can I look for more information? Thanks. Julie. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 29 June, 2006 - Circus historian Richard W. Flint resides in Baltimore and so does James Taylor, an expert on side show matters. Perhaps they can offer some insights? Checking of Baltimore city directories should provide further documentation, including occupation listings during some time periods. Traveling showmen were typically listed as such. The circus affiliation seems tenuous. Any number of costume and wardrobe pieces have a circus look. If that's the only connection to the business, I'd recommend first establishing it as being period circus wardrobe. Fred Dahlinger

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1303. Conneaut, OH accident, 23 April, 2006 - At Conneaut, Ohio in the 1940's two (and possibly three) elephants were killed when the truck carrying them stalled on the New York Central railroad tracks and was struck by a train. The elephants were buried in a grave located on Lake Road, between Conneaut and Ashtabula Ohio. I would like to determine the date of the accident and the name of the circus that was involved. Thank you, Richard (Bud) Halliday, Sacramento, CA. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 24 April, 2006 - Part of this story is told in Slim Lewis' book "Elephant Tramp," where he tells of Bill Hart driving a Lewis Bros Circus semi in front of a moving train, causing the death of two elephants and their trainer Paul Miller. A 1942 elephant census dated the accident as June 15, 1941 and identified the elephants as "Jumbo Lou" and "Two Ton Tony" but one of them was definitely Sparks Alice, whom I believe Buckles shows as coming on the Sparks show as a youngster in 1929 and putting in some time on Ringling-Barnum before being sold to Paul Lewis. Ree-gards, Ole Whitey

    Reply: 24 April, 2006 - You must be referring to Lewis Bros. Circus. Their only elephant "Alice" was lost when the truck in which she was riding was was struck by a train in Conneaut, Ohio June 15, 1941. Buckles

    Reply: 24 April, 2006 - The show qwas called Lewis Bros. Circus and Wild West. I have an elephant named Two Ton Tony died June 15, 1941 from the truck wreck and another named Jumbo Lou which died three days later on June 18, 1941. Bob Cline

    Reply: 25 April, 2006 - "Alice" was imported to the Sparks Cicus in 1922 and remained until that show was taken off the road following the 1931 season. All 9 Sparks elephants were then absorbed into the Ringling-Barnum herd in 1932 which already had an elephant of the same name, hence "Ringling Alice" and "Sparks Alice". Following the 1934 season "Sparks Alice" was sold to Lewis Bros. Circus and remained there until her death in 1941. I have a number of pictures of her during this period, always alone so I would appreciate any background on "Jumbo Lou" and "Two Ton Tony". BUCKLESW@tampabay,rr.com

    Reply: 26 April, 2006 - I pulled my copies of newspapers out and sent them to Buckles today. The newspaper photos in 1938 refer to the full grown female Asian as Jumbo Lou. This occurs in 1939, 1940 and 1941. The 1939 paper refers to elephants and mention Tony by name. By the time of the accident, Tony is mentioned as being three years old however they refer to Jumbo Lou as 49 years old. Since she was imported in 1922, her age doesn’t figure out correctly. There are several articles also that state replacement elephants have been bought and should be delivered to the show on June 30, 1941 but I cannot find anything that says they actually arrived. In fact a July 23, 1941 article is a typical press release and still uses Tony and Jumbo Lou by name as the elephants about to appear in your town. Buckles is the undisputed Elephant Historian, hands down. He has been an invaluable source of help over these last two years of emails and his daily blog. I have to then assume that Jumbo Lou is a name change for the elephant known as Sparks Alice. Tony on the other hand is a mystery. I don’t even know if Tony was used to name a Male or a Female in this case. Bob Cline

    Reply: 06 December, 2006 - I am Paul Lewis's niece. Uncle Paul was the owner of Lewis Brothers' circus. I remember well the early morning telephone call from Ohio telling us that the two elephants, trainer and dog, I believe a large greyhound, had been hit by a train and killed. My father, a lawyer, younger brother of Paul, immediately chartered a small plane and pilot and flew to the scene to handle legal aspects of the incident. The larger, older elephant was named "Laura," but called "Lou" when my uncle acquired her. My Dad renamed her "Lew" because of Lewis Brothers' circus. The smaller elephant may have been named Tony. Neither my sister nor I can recall. It was a male, and never fully trained for performance, so appeared only in the menagerie, in the"spec" and such. He was killed before he could reach his potential. He was about half the size of Lou or Lew. My father, in a little written history pegged the date at 1942. I think 1941 is correct. I had a copy of the Canneault (or nearby) newspaper for the day after the accident, or the day of, but cannot find it. I think my sister has it, and I'm trying to get a copy from her. Then we'd have the exact date. I may have another source for that information. The train signal was not working, and that was the cause of the accident. The June 18, 1941 date in Reply 24 sounds correct to me. Re: Reply 26: Replacements were never bought, but my uncle hired an elephant act to complete that season and thereafter. Insurance was virtually impossible to get, so he had none. Interesting sidelight: My father's notes say that Lou (Lew) was twice taken to Washington, D.C. to participate in inaugurations of Republican Presidents, but he doesn't tell us which ones. I do remember their taking her to our Jackson, MIchigan depot to welcome Wendell Willkie when campaigned in Jackson for the Presidency. Jackson is one of two towns claiming to the the birthplace of the Republican party, the other being Ripon, Wisconsin. T.H. STANTON, bgsths@msn.com

    Reply: 18 Sep 2007 - I want to thank you all who responded to my question about the two elephants that were killed (along with their trainer, Paul Richard Miller of Charlotte, Michigan and a Dobermann Pinscher) at Conneaut,Ohio. They were all riding in the trailer of a semi that was struck by a New York Central passenger train, the "Lake Shore Limited", at 5:10 AM Sunday, June 15th, 1941. The trainer, Paul Miller was killed instantly as were the two elephants and the dog. The elephants were 40 year old "Jumbo Lou" weighing 4 tons, and 14 year old "Two Ton Tony" Coming from Burma and India, both were expertly trained by Miller. The driver of the truck was Charles Oswald who disappeared after the accident and could not be located. There was no crossing guard and a string of box cars on a siding to the East obscured Oswalds view of the oncoming West-bound train. Jumbo Lou was hurled nearly 50 yards west of the crossing and died of a broken back. Two Ton Tony was thrown about 25 yards and died of a crushed head. The circus was Lewis Bros. owned by Paul M Lewis of Jackson, Michigan and played the next day in Corry, PA. - the show did go on. I visited Conneaut on September 9, 2007 and have copies of the Conneaut News Herald of June 16, 1941 which have the details of the accident and will be happy to send a copy to all who are interested. Richard (Bud) Halliday - halliday@cwnet.com

    Reply: 22 Sep 2007 - I want to thank you all who responded to my question about the elephants that were killed (along with their trainer and a Great Dane dog). They were all riding in the trailer of a semi that was struck by a New York Central passenger train, the "Lake Shore Limited", at 5:10 AM Sunday,June 15th, 1941. The trainer was Paul Richard Miller of Charlotte, Michigan was killed instantly as were the two elephants and the dog. The elephants were 40 year old "Jumbo Lou" weighing 4 tons, and 14 year old "Two Ton Tony" Coming from Burma and India, both were expertly trained by Miller. The driver of the truck was Charles Oswald who disappeared after the accident and could not be located. There was no crossing guard and a string of box cars on a siding to the East obscured Oswalds view of the oncoming train. Jumbo Lou was hurled nearly 50 yards west of the crossing and died of a broken back. Two Ton Tony was thrown about 25 yards and died of a crushed head. The circus was Lewis Bros. and played the next day in Corry, PA. I visited Conneaut on September 9, 2007 and have copies of the Conneaut News Herald of June 16, 1941 which have the details of the accident and will be happy to send a copy to all who are interested. Richard Halliday - halliday@cwnet.com

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1302. Jomar RR car, 23 April, 2006 - Am requesting any info/data/referrences regarding the JOMAR, John and Mable Ringling's private railroad car. It is sidetracked here in Sarasota where it is lovingly being restored and brought back to life by a small group of dedicated volunteers. In time it will once again take to the rails and showcase an era gone by. I have found many sources but would welcome anything of interest. Many thanks, (Ms.) JM Davis. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 01 Feb 2008 - I saw this car in Dec and really don't know they will ever be able to restore it. I had heard about the restoration but had no idea it was in such terrible shape. I have drawings of the origial car that I have been cleaning up and showing how both sides of it looked. I have only one photo of the outside and one of the inside palor area when John Ringling North owned the car. I have been looking for other photos with no luck, but will keep trying. If anyone else can help please do. I will be back in Sarasota again this fall to see how Bob is doing with it and have lunch there again. ASCircus@aol.com

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1301. Concessions, 23 April, 2006 - We are researching various circus related web sites to find information regarding concessions. Our question is have concessions been a historical part of a circus? And would they be consider an essential part of the circus historically or even an essential part of a circus in 2006? Any assistance would be sincerely appreciated. Please respond to Blosekamp@Ngjensen.Com. Respond to this message, replies go to this board, not to the message sender.

    Reply: 24 April, 2006 - Concessions have always (beginning in 18th century), been a part of the circus. It started with whiskey stands and segued into such treats as peppermint sticks, gingerbread, "pop beer" (root beer), and into peanuts and lemonade. See my book "Traveling Showman" for examples. I have a contract for a concession stand in the 1840s. Stuart Thayer.

    Reply: 24 April, 2006 - Concessions have been and always will be keeping the show on the road. Over the years and with various venues, different approaches have been taken in contract negotiations with arenas for such grand shows as the huge Shrine Dates or Ringling dates. Sometimes the arena wants concession privileges more than the Show is willing to give. The show either looses money or looses the date and location. Ringling is a prime example of how important their concessions are to them. It is referred to as per capitia spending. Basically an average amount of money generated by the sale of concessions divided by the average attendance. This figure will never be released to the media. Per Capitia Spending will make or break the show's profits over the years.
          As for the tented shows, no show can exist with out a solid "Front End". My under canvas days started out on Circus Kirk in the early 1970's. The basic formula was the Side Show Income kept the cookhouse open everyday. The "Front End" meaning the pit shows, novelties, and concessions kept us moving up and down the highways and provided our operating expenses. The Big Top ticket sales covered the Payroll and Profits. The other formula that works as well was by July 4th of your season, all expenses should have been met and you were now putting money away to get you through the winter and make any improvements for the new year. I don't know how far back you want to go Historically, but financially a show can't make it without concessions. Bob Cline

    Reply: 30 April, 2006 - Gil Gray told me one time that once in a while he would book a date that he knew that the show would only break even, but as long as he had ALL concessions he would do all right. Robert Mitchell

    Reply: 14 June, 2006 - The Circus has and will always be an excuse to run a popcorn stand.... and thank God or who ever. Al Stencell

    Reply: 14 July, 2006 - Regarding concessions; as a clown working for Rudy and Elfi Altof Jacoby owners of the Austrian National Circus and Rudy Bros. in the U.S.A. I once ask Rudy in 1971 what he thought of the Circus. He stated to me that it was the Circus business; and with out concessions their would be no Circus. David Harrington.

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